Becca also discusses the importance of understanding the needs and experiences of foster children. She emphasizes the need to approach their behavior with empathy and compassion, recognizing that trauma and pain are often behind their actions. Becca shares an inspirational story of a group of siblings placed in different foster homes but maintained a strong bond and continued to support each other. She also addresses the issue of caseworker burnout and highlights the importance of self-care and staying authentic to provide the best support for children and families.
Takeaways
– Therapeutic foster homes provide intensive support for children with high-intensity needs, while general foster homes offer less intensive care.
– Adverse childhood experiences (ACEs) are traumatic experiences that children endure, and they can have a significant impact on their well-being.
– Finding qualified foster parents is crucial, especially for teenagers who often face conflict with their parents.
– Stable homes for older youth are in high demand in the foster care system.
– Understanding and addressing the underlying trauma behind a child’s behavior is essential for effective care and support. Approach the behavior of foster children with empathy and compassion, recognizing that there is often trauma and pain behind their actions.
– Maintaining sibling relationships is crucial for the well-being of foster children, even if they are placed in different foster homes.
– Caseworker burnout is a significant issue in the child protection sector, and self-care and authenticity are essential for managing the emotional challenges of the job.
– Supporting foster families is just as important as being a foster family, as it helps them stay in the game and love the children well.
– Continued education and seeking therapy can help caseworkers develop the skills and tools necessary to support children with trauma.
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TRANSCRIPT:
Courtney (00:02.981)
Welcome to the Foster Friendly podcast. I’m Courtney Williams, joined by my co -host, Travis Vongsness. And today we’re joined by a foster care caseworker who uses her knowledge of trauma to support foster parents and youth in care. Becca Bramley went to Fort Lewis College for psychology. Then I went to get her master’s degree in social work at the University of Denver. She’s been a foster care caseworker for three years and is currently the therapeutic foster care program manager for La Palma County in Colorado.
Welcome to the podcast, Becca.
Becca Bramley (00:34.496)
Hi, happy to be here. Thanks for having me.
Travis (00:37.646)
Great to have you. Well, tell us a little bit more about yourself, anything, maybe even hobbies, something maybe people wouldn’t even know about Becca and then then more into your education and what led you into becoming involved in this profession.
Becca Bramley (00:51.616)
Sure, well a little bit about my background. So kind of like Courtney mentioned, I went to Fort Lewis College and got my psychology degree. And I come from a family who struggles with substances and mental health. So it was definitely something that I was passionate about from the get go. And then I graduated and I traveled around for a little bit.
And then I decided that I wanted to go get my master’s in social work. And I had no idea what I wanted to go into. I just, the beauty of social work is it’s such a broad umbrella. And so you can kind of get, choose which path you want to take, so to speak. Because for a while I thought about I wanted to go into counseling, but I wanted more of a, I guess, broad spoke.
of kind of what I could go into. And so then that’s the beauty of social work is you can, you know, work in schools and be a social worker. And then I also can have this position of being a therapeutic foster care coordinator and work with families. And yeah, and I’m actually currently working towards getting certified as a synergetic play therapist. So I really love working with kids and just connecting with kids on.
a mind -body connection because that can, and we’ll talk about this, but so much of, you know, trauma is a disconnect from the mind and the body. And so exploring that with kids and just having them create an awareness of having that connection with their mind and body.
So that’s a little bit about me on my education side. On my personal side, I live in Durango. I have a partner and we have a German short hair dog who we love dearly. We’re pretty advocates. We’re big skiers, runners, hikers. We love to do outdoorsy things. I mean, that’s what drew us to the San Juan’s and living in Durango was the mountains. So we love living down in our little…
Becca Bramley (03:04.064)
Southwest town down here.
Travis (03:07.342)
I love it. Very Colorado of you with all that stuff, but nice. Very cool. And I love to like, you know, it seems like a lot of social workers and caseworkers, sort of the inspiration to actually become, you know, involved. It sounds like your story as well of just something from the heart, something from the past that maybe it was a pain point or something, you know, to overcome and then to really have compassion to that. So, you’re now a caseworker through a therapeutic foster program.
Courtney (03:08.119)
Yeah. Yeah.
Becca Bramley (03:09.408)
Yes, born and raised too, so never left.
Travis (03:36.238)
Tell us a little bit more about therapeutic foster care and kind of the difference between that and then just general foster parents.
Becca Bramley (03:43.68)
Sure. So as Courtney mentioned, I have been in this field for going on three years and I really didn’t see myself being in child welfare. So I came in knowing nothing about foster care, child welfare. And then the first year that I started working here.
La Plata County did just have general foster homes and we were in the process of becoming a county that has therapeutic homes. And within the state of Colorado, we’re only, I think we only have three as of now, but La Plata County was one of the first to have the Therapeutic Foster Care Program. So I would say we were kind of the guinea pigs of this program for sure. And I had the opportunity to take it and so I did.
And so general foster home is, it’s not as intense of an intensive program as therapeutic. And it consists of monthly home visits for the caseworker coming in and checking in on the family and the kids.
or the child and youth. And therapeutic foster care incorporates treatment for special physical, psychological, or emotional needs of a child and youth who’s placed with a specially trained foster home. So the foster home that is a therapeutic home completes over 32 hours of training on how to best support a child with these high intensity needs. A lot of times,
We see kids who are placed in therapeutic homes when they are placed in a residential home and they’re being placed down into a therapeutic home or when they are brought into foster care and their needs are really high that they need to be placed in a.
Becca Bramley (05:35.712)
higher level of care home. So that would be the therapeutic home versus a general foster home. And therapeutic foster care is provided through an integration of services with key interventions and support provided by a therapeutic foster care providers. And we are trained and supervised by La Plata County Human Services and our other partners. We collaborate with our community and our team members, our partners who provide support for the
child and youth and their family. Reunification is always the goal that we have with our system.
And ideally for therapeutic home, the child is only in the home between three to six months. And then the clinician and or a caseworker is seeing the family and kid on a bi -weekly basis to incorporate intervention plans, behavior trackers, and just overall support to the child and youth within those three to six months to create sustainability, long -term care,
Courtney (06:14.469)
And I really…
Becca Bramley (06:43.026)
longevity for the family. And then depending on the case, because every case is different, the kid would either be reunified back in their home and then as the therapeutic caseworker, I would then implement those interventions into the bio.
families home and state like this has been working in the foster home, this is what’s been going really well, this is how we’ve been able to co -regulate, regulate ourselves to mitigate any behavior that’s coming up. So I would just like I’ve said it’s very more hands -on and more intensive of an overall program.
Travis (07:27.982)
Okay, that’s really helpful.
Courtney (07:28.805)
Yeah, and I can say as a previous general foster home and now a therapeutic foster home, Becca is actually my caseworker. So I get to work with her closely. It is a difference and it’s almost, you know, I never want to talk people out of becoming a therapeutic home, but it is almost a full -time job. I mean, there are a lot more expectations of the home, a lot more appointments, it’s just things on your schedule. But the beauty of it, like Becca said, one thing I wish,
Becca Bramley (07:47.168)
Mm -hmm.
Courtney (07:55.909)
it was really necessary for all reunification plans is to have that co -insisting plan where they’re working with the birth families to make it when they’re reunified, we wanna see that successful, right? So to give them those tools and those tips and those resources that often they don’t get, it’s really sad to see. Yeah.
Becca Bramley (07:58.112)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (08:13.856)
Yeah, no exactly. And I would say, you know, the last piece too is if you think about it, it is that in between between a general foster home and residential. And so it is that kid is needing those services, those appointments.
that hands on attention from their team member and the wraparound really, the wraparound from La Plata County, from the other community partners, from their therapists, to really make them feel heard and loved so that then they can start being able to process the healing that they went through.
Courtney (08:54.597)
So speaking of what they’ve gone through, trauma has really become a buzzword since COVID. To be honest, I kind of get annoyed with it at times because I feel like it’s overused. And with the overuse of the word trauma, we’re kind of hearing it everywhere all of a sudden. I feel like it downplays situations that really are linked to trauma, especially when we’re talking about childhood trauma. So experts categorize childhood trauma into three categories of ACEs, or adverse childhood experiences.
Becca Bramley (08:58.784)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (09:03.584)
Mm -hmm.
Courtney (09:20.741)
And I’ve read that the average youth in care has experienced four to five of those ACEs. Can you, Becca, just tell us a little bit more about ACEs, what they are and what you see in the youth in care?
Becca Bramley (09:26.24)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (09:30.816)
Mm -hmm. So as you said, ACES stands for Adverse Childhood Experiences, which are traumatic experiences a child endures during childhood. And this can be from 0 to 17 years old. These experiences can include violence, abuse, neglect, witnessing their loved ones or family, experiencing some type of abuse, having a loved one.
attempt suicide, die, it can, sexual abuse, it can be an array of anything and really what trauma means and we talk about, I won’t go into this too much, but from my school, it’s the big T versus the little T and like the big traumas versus the little trauma, but it’s still, it affects the body and what the kid is going through, what anyone is going through.
And that is when that mind -body connection becomes lost. Because then when kids experience trauma, they go into that fight or flight. And so either they’re fighting and their lid is flipped.
Or they go into that flight state, which is like a freeze and they can’t process anything about what’s actually going on. And then being able to have that awareness within their body of like, this is actually what I’m feeling. I’m feeling really scared right now or I’m feeling really sad because X, Y, Z is going on. So we see this a ton with our kids. I mean,
Unfortunately, any kid who is within our system, they’ve experienced some type of trauma or ACEs because they’re in our system for a reason. Whether they experienced abuse or they witnessed their parents or like I said, someone in their family who experienced it. And then it was due to them not being in a safe environment anymore, which is why then they have come into our care, which is foster care.
Travis (11:16.014)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (11:34.638)
Okay.
Well, kind of getting back to also to the sort of foster home versus, you know, general foster home versus therapeutic. What do you look for in a general foster parent or incoming foster home that you’d consider good qualifications for becoming a therapeutic home?
Courtney (11:37.669)
Well, kind of getting back to all sort of the foster homes or the general foster homes that you mentioned there. What do you look for in a general foster care home or in a foster home? Do you consider good quality patients for becoming…
Becca Bramley (11:53.728)
Sure, the first thing I would always say is I’m always curious, always curious what brought them here and just coming from a lens of curiosity. What are their intentions? Experience is an important piece. So for a general foster home, I would say that is the ultimate question of being curious in what their intentions are.
And then kind of from there, start building a foundation of their interest of becoming a general foster home. Then taking that next step of, you know, what I would consider good qualifications of becoming a therapeutic home. That’s where I would mention the experience piece. And like Courtney mentioned, her and Bobby, they have been foster parents for 17 years.
Courtney (12:18.757)
and then kind of somewhere start building the county.
Becca Bramley (12:42.816)
And so to us that was like, well, they have a lot of experience. And so I want it, I think that they would have a lot of value in becoming a therapeutic home. For families who are coming into foster care, I definitely ask the why behind it. And that’s what I’m mentioning on my lens of curiosity. Because if they’re here to adopt, I do try to direct them into another.
agency because that’s not the point of foster care. The point is to reunify with the families and you create a home and a space to support the youth and their families but then with the intention of but I want you to go back to them if it’s a safe and healthy environment for you. So then I would say for a therapeutic home I mean experience kind of also looking into
Courtney (13:26.693)
So when I get sick, I need to get serious. I need to get serious.
Becca Bramley (13:35.04)
what their profession is and if they have worked with kids at higher level needs, what qualifications they have, and ultimately hearing their stories. Where did they come from? What type of home did they grow up in? Because then that can also, you know, that creates experience too. So,
Travis (13:52.622)
Hmm.
Courtney (13:55.173)
So, that’s what I do at the end of the day.
Becca Bramley (13:55.616)
I, but I do like within therapeutic, I do have a rule of thumb of being a general foster home at least for a year if they have no experience in foster care. So then they can just get their feet wet and really have the experience of, you know, this is what it was like with a five year old versus a 13 or 17 year old. because no kid has the same behavior. Every kid has their own experience, their own journey, and they’re going to have their own behavior around.
and none of it is gonna be the same. And so having just the different types of experiences with youth and families, I think can bring a lot of value to foster families. Because some might like come in being like, yes, we wanna be a general foster home, and then after, or sorry, a therapeutic, and then after a year, they’re like, no, I’m gonna stay as just a general home, or I really wanna provide respite for our foster families. So it also allows them a full year to kind of,
like sit in and simmer in what this actually is because it can be a lot. Also, I would like, I’ve seen it in families and their relationships with one another and navigating that and certain triggers that they thought they overcame, but then a kid comes at them in a certain point that like hits them, like that triggers them in a point. And then it’s like, okay, now let’s reflect on that of why that’s bothering you or whatever it might be.
Travis (14:59.47)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (15:14.99)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Hmm.
Courtney (15:21.605)
Yeah.
Becca Bramley (15:22.496)
So that’s where I feel like it’s the important piece of at least being a foster parent for a year before really stepping into that higher level of being a therapeutic home. And then like I had mentioned, it’s more training hours. Therapeutic foster homes need 32 hours of training every year compared to a general foster home needs 20. So it’s 12 hours of additional training.
Courtney (15:48.161)
Yeah. Yeah, kind of on the same sense, Becca, I often talk to people, you know, when I’m recruiting, if they’re even interested in fostering, I encourage them to just start as a respite care provider, you know, jump in that way, get your toes wet, understand the system, and then do the general and kind of like that stepping stone respite, then general, then therapeutic could even be a great path for people to just get to know the system and what really are your gifts and abilities for your family before you because you don’t we don’t like to see kids bounce around. And you know, that happens when people get in over their
Travis (15:48.718)
That’s, I don’t know.
Becca Bramley (15:58.816)
Mm -hmm. Yep.
Becca Bramley (16:12.48)
Totally.
Travis (16:15.534)
Yeah.
Becca Bramley (16:15.712)
Mm -mm. Yep. Yeah. And exactly, Courtney, that’s like what I really want to try and avoid within our system is the bouncing around piece because it is so disruptive for kids’ nervous systems.
Courtney (16:17.477)
over their heads a little bit and then kids are bounced around.
Travis (16:20.718)
Yeah.
Becca Bramley (16:33.312)
and their belief in who they are is like, I am not in this family anymore, so now I’m going to be into this next family. And that’s the other piece that I want to point on is like exploring their profession, because you can work with a foster family who is a teacher and works with kids within the school with higher intensive needs.
Travis (16:33.962)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (16:56.8)
And then it’s like, do you actually want to come home to that as well? Because then that can be really exhausting. And so that is a great option of like, what about respite right now? Because, you know, I think a lot of people come in, in over their heads and thinking that they can do this, but then in reality, it is so hard emotionally. And you need to be able to have your foundation and like your…
what your intentions are to be able to like stand your ground because it can be very challenging.
Travis (17:31.31)
Yeah. And I think like too, like, as we’re going to talk more also about supporting foster families and how important that is also to, as to your point, Becca of, of mitigating some of the continued disruptive placements or whatever. And I think I’ve read too, somewhere where like even starting a new school in a new home or whatever, four to six months academic loss. I mean, that’s massive in educational impact as well.
Courtney (17:40.829)
I think I’ve read…
Courtney (17:50.117)
home whatever, four to six months after.
Becca Bramley (17:50.624)
Yep.
Becca Bramley (17:56.736)
yeah, for sure.
Courtney (17:56.901)
Yeah. Yeah. And it’s interesting also, as I’ve worked in this field now for years, you see trends in foster care in certain situations leading to placement. You know, this is a national podcast, but even I see things in Colorado and I talked to my friends that live in Tennessee or South Dakota and they say, we’re seeing the same things. So it feels like there’s kind of these trends that move through. What are you kind of seeing right now as current trends and the needs in foster care?
Becca Bramley (18:23.807)
Yeah, so I would say current trends that we see are a lot of families who have closed due to permanency or adoption or when their home becomes too full. And so within like we are a small county and so it is harder to get foster families. We’re not bigger counties who have a lot of homes that are interested in being foster care.
in foster care. So I would say like that would definitely be a trend. We’ve actually seen quite a bit, which is interesting, of youth in conflict, which we haven’t seen as much in the past. Meaning that, and this is where…
we are in a need for foster homes is for teenagers. Because a lot of homes, again, I think they come in and they have this idea of what foster care is, and in reality, it’s not. So they’re like, I wanna come in and I wanna adopt this baby. And that’s where I’m almost redirect them into an adoption agency.
because that’s not why that shouldn’t be the intention is kind of how I try to redirect it because like I said we have a need for homes with for teenagers because we have a lot of teenagers who have conflict with parents and especially I think we’ve seen the shift since COVID of just kind of that resistance that
teenagers and kids have towards parents and then parents feeling at a loss. And then unfortunately, I mean not feeling supported by their community, by teachers and kind of having this idea that they need to do it on their own. So then that is when you know youth and conflict rises and then we get involved.
Travis (19:59.726)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (20:18.176)
So that’s what I would say is, I mean, the need we’re seeking is looking for providers just in general and who are passionate with any age, but specifically there is a bigger need for teens and teenagers within our community is what I’ve noticed.
Courtney (20:35.813)
Yeah. And I’d say that’s for sure a national trend, a national need is homes for the older youth. I’d say 10 and above is often the hard to place kiddos or the kids that get bounced around like we were talking about from home to home to home.
Becca Bramley (20:38.976)
Mm -hmm.
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Yep. Which, you know, it’s almost, it’s cliche because kids who are bouncing around from home to home and their behaviors are so big and intense.
Travis (20:49.838)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (21:02.432)
they’re trying to say something and they’re trying to belong. And that’s the message I want to get across to everyone is like, listen to those behaviors and not taking it personally. Rather, it’s the kid trying to ask for something that they need that hasn’t been met.
Travis (21:03.886)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (21:24.8)
And so they are expressing it through anger, through yelling, through crying, through whatever emotion it is. But we see it most commonly in anger and aggression. And kids can, especially like bigger kids, like they can be intimidating and scary, but it’s actually really looking into.
Travis (21:36.654)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (21:46.176)
what you know the other side of what’s actually going on for this kid because they’re trying to express something and a need that they’re needing but they don’t know how to do it.
Travis (21:50.286)
Hmm.
Courtney (21:58.149)
Yeah, Dr. Bruce Perry and Oprah Winfrey wrote a book a few years ago now called What Happened to You? And I love that question. If not, like, what’s wrong with this child? It’s more what happened to them and how can I support them and see that need behind the behavior and understand that there’s something there. Like you were just saying, there’s something there, there’s a reason, and we just need to get to the root of it and help them. And sometimes that’s crying with them. Sometimes that’s letting them be for a while. You know, people ask me, how do you do it? And how do you do it with kids in your home?
Becca Bramley (22:00.032)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (22:07.936)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Travis (22:09.39)
Hmm.
Travis (22:15.95)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (22:22.048)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (22:25.006)
Hmm.
Courtney (22:27.301)
That’s what people are often scared of. Like you bring in these teenagers who have big emotions, but you already have kids in the home. And again, it’s just educating, educating our kids as well. And, you know, these are often teens who are going through hard things and we need to have that empathy and compassion to help them and support them and show them that they belong. They belong on this earth. They belong, you know, in a family. They belong to, they are, they deserve love and compassion and empathy.
Becca Bramley (22:29.312)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (22:41.056)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (22:47.423)
Mm -hmm.
Courtney (22:55.077)
and also just people to rally around them, because that’s what they need is people.
Becca Bramley (22:58.048)
Yep, yep, and their community and to feel that, I mean exactly Courtney, to feel that piece of just being vulnerable and safe because they may have never known how to feel that.
Travis (23:11.094)
Hmm. Man. And, and just, thinking too of how the, the aspect of, as you’re talking about, like the anger and just trying to process also, like what’s even happening. I just often think about the, I described the being in foster care is just a swirling uncertainty that just pervades everything in your day to day. It’s like, what is the next outcome of even tomorrow? What’s happening to me? If we, we know what it’s like to just be teenagers, even if we had stable families, like.
Becca Bramley (23:39.296)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (23:40.878)
prom and just how like awkward and like anxiety or in it can be just like that. But then add you’re in someone else’s home, not knowing if you’re going to go to another school or so. I think even just like you’re saying, coming back to just the compassionate, like put yourself in their shoes, man, how would you even be relating to life? And so, but kind of speaking of that, I know Becca, you have like unbelievable hard things daily in your team and just what you guys go through on the front lines.
Courtney (23:42.181)
I mean, just how awkward and anxiety -ridden that can be is just like that. But then, after someone else is home, not knowing if you can go to my school or… So I think you can just like just say, I’m coming back.
Becca Bramley (23:50.304)
Mm -hmm.
Courtney (23:55.621)
Yeah.
Courtney (24:01.765)
I know, Becca, you have like unbelievable heart and spirit and team and just what you guys go through on the front lines. So I have to imagine you have to explain to the whole thing, like the story, the faces, you know, the kids that just… So do you have an inspirational story or food that helps you keep going as an example?
Travis (24:10.83)
So I have to imagine you have to cling to the hope and inspiration of the stories, the faces, you know, the kids that just keep you going in those moments. So can you, do you have an inspirational story or two just that, that helps keep you going as an example?
Becca Bramley (24:25.344)
Yeah, I mean, I just, Travis, I laugh because you have to also like, yes, I mean, I show up to work some days and I have no idea what I’m gonna show up to. You know, some days it’s like pretty chill, other days it’s like complete chaos and we’re in a crisis situation all day. But you have to keep it light and you have to keep humor within it. And I think, you know, that’s the piece though is like,
kids always will have humor. Kids, and that is where it’s like just joking with a teenager and just kids, it’s like, and being, you know, kind of having that sarcastic humor with them will just lighten up things so by so much. And that’s something I’ve really, you know.
Courtney (25:07.877)
will just slightly affect the field of art so much. And that’s something I really, you know, cultivated in this job is like, other than this, like this will say, Bert’s work brings to you native music, and not just the other.
Becca Bramley (25:16.896)
Cultivated in this job is like, okay, just keep it light. Kids will say hurtful things to you and they will be mean. And that is, again, where you just have to kind of change that perspective and be like, and this is what you’re feeling. And because then it’s being projected onto me. And how hard that must be that you’re feeling this. So let me explore that with you. And so…
Courtney (25:39.173)
So let me explore. And so I would say just like, so her…
Becca Bramley (25:44.864)
I would say just like the resiliency in kids is and that I see every day is definitely inspiring. Just what some of these kids have seen, have gone through, being placed in home to home. And you’re as a caseworker, you’re the consistent person in their lives for a long time. They’re the ones that they know that they’re gonna most likely see you either bi -weekly or once a month.
You’re the ones who are asking them if they feel safe in the home and you really start to build that rapport and trust with kids because you really need to make it known that you are on their team. And so I would say, yeah, I just thought the resiliency that I witnessed in these kids is inspiring and foster parents who continue to show up and support these children and youth and their families.
Courtney (26:29.701)
And so I would say, yeah, I think that we’re going to see that again.
Travis (26:37.486)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (26:42.304)
But there have been so many different type of cases and families I’ve worked with and they all have their own beautiful stories and experiences. But I would say one that comes to mind is, so this case was actually when I first started and I’m still working with the family now. But when I first started, there was a group of siblings who kind of their age range from like,
Courtney (26:43.429)
there.
Courtney (26:52.453)
but I would say one that.
Becca Bramley (27:10.976)
seven to sixteen and there was four of them, two boys and two girls. And their mom had died of overdose and they all had different dads who were not really in the picture. And so when their mom died, that was kind of all that they had. And they did have a grandma who was supporting them, but she was not in a place to be able to keep all of them and just be due to her age and having four.
Courtney (27:20.773)
Thank you.
Becca Bramley (27:40.416)
kids. And so we unfortunately did have, we didn’t have a home at the time who would take all four siblings, but we did have a couple who would be interested in taking the two younger ones and then a single provider who wanted to take the two older kids. And so,
Courtney (27:41.733)
And so the important thing is to have a good set of hands.
Courtney (28:00.229)
So that’s kind of where we left it. We had a provider having teenagers, a couple having younger.
Becca Bramley (28:01.408)
That’s kind of where we left it, was the single provider having two teenagers, the couple having the younger, and then the family navigated the challenges and they made it a priority to have the siblings keep a relationship and see each other. So they did weekly dinners with one another, they provided respite for one another, and they were all within Durango and Bayfield area. And so they really just wrapped around each other and supported each other so that these kids,
could still be siblings. Like, yes, due to the fact that they couldn’t be living in the same home, they were still a family. And to this day, it still is. They actually all ended up being adopted, two of the teenagers by the single provider and then the two younger ones by the couple. And they still have family dinners. They still see each other. They still all go to church. They definitely make it a priority that they’re in each other’s lives.
Courtney (28:40.901)
And for this day, it’s been good. They actually all ended up eating a broccoli. Two of the teenagers by the…
Becca Bramley (29:00.96)
And so that’s like one of the many stories that are really inspiring because it’s like the last thing we want to do is have to separate kids, especially siblings. But to me, it’s like how cool that the foster family made it a priority to keep them in each other’s lives. And even though they weren’t living in the same home, they were still siblings and they were still seeing each other on a weekly basis or more.
Courtney (29:02.917)
And so that’s like one of them.
Travis (29:13.806)
Yeah.
Travis (29:31.662)
I love that.
Becca Bramley (29:31.808)
So that to me is just the message of like, and to like, they wanted, they continued to keep their grandma involved in their life. And if the teenagers wanted to go stay with their grandma or the youngest kids, they still could. And so then all of them just had this strong relationship with one another and became a family. Even though they weren’t blood related, they were still a family.
Courtney (29:32.069)
So that’s me and the semester.
Courtney (29:41.445)
Thank you.
Courtney (29:58.949)
I love that. Yeah, well, as we kind of close out this episode, talk to me a little bit, Becca, about caseworker burnout. In fact, statistics show that in the child protection sector, 75 % of social workers report at high levels of emotional exhaustion. I can imagine it’s emotionally hard, a hard profession to be in dealing with youth who are, you know, youth in conflict, youth who have gone through some really hard things.
Becca Bramley (29:59.968)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (30:02.222)
Yeah, it’s really powerful.
Courtney (30:28.325)
and you’re hearing those stories all the time, you’re walking through those stories, how do you keep going? And do you have encouragement for other people in this field that are just entering or part of this field that are feeling that burnout?
Becca Bramley (30:39.424)
Yeah, I mean, I’m not going to ignore that it is a very challenging profession. And we unfortunately do see quite a bit of turnover. Interesting enough, it’s actually between the, I read a study that it’s between 18 to 24 months.
is when caseworkers start to have that turnover and it’s either they stay or they go. Because I would say after two years is kind of when you are like, okay, I somewhat know what I’m doing and I am also in this, like I’m in this thing.
So I would say ways in which I cope is seeking my own therapy and I see my therapist on a bi -weekly basis. I continue to educate myself in how to best support youth with trauma and really, like I said before, and really pay attention to their cues and the behaviors that they’re demonstrating. Because I think that is the biggest thing and I always remind myself,
almost as a mantra, is keeping one foot in and one foot out. So meaning I stay present with the youth or family that I’m working with and I’m intentional with them. However, I’m not becoming too consumed in it.
And so that’s kind of the like keeping one foot in, one foot out where I’m there and I’m with them and I’m having that compassion. I’m having that empathy with them. However, I’m not letting it consume me and overpower me. Cause then that’s where I really feel like the burnout starts to happen. And then I just continue to, you know, I work on ways I’m mindful about how I keep myself regulated.
Becca Bramley (32:29.536)
And so that then I can demonstrate co -regulation with the kid, because you are always needing to keep yourself regulated when you’re with these kids. And educate them and create an environment of how to be an external regulator. So I’m always being like, whew, it’s feeling like a lot right now. Or I’m feeling like my body is just, my stomach is.
Travis (32:37.134)
Mm -hmm. Mm -hmm.
Courtney (32:39.493)
And I think they found a great method.
Becca Bramley (32:55.456)
cringing or whatever it is, or my heart is hurting and placing my hand on my heart. Cause then you really start to demonstrate to these kids again, how to have that mind body connection. Because it’s ways just to bring them down a notch. And then the last thing I would say is just staying authentic and true to myself. Constantly having the reflective awareness of, you know,
Travis (33:11.182)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (33:22.528)
How am I demonstrating to this kid that I’m who I am? And like I said, like being silly, like being silly with kids can be such a good rapport builder and just lighten up the load on a lot of things because sometimes kids just think they have to be so serious or these things that they’ve gone through. And sometimes you just like need to laugh, need to like let off some steam a little bit and then come back to it. And then they’re in a place that they can actually like process with you.
Travis (33:32.302)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (33:52.064)
So yeah, I would say like I have all these tools and skills in my toolbox, so to speak. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don’t. And then I think just like I mentioned before, the inspiring piece of working with child and youth, biological families, foster families, and you know, what they’re going through and it’s real and it’s life and it’s raw and being able to
Courtney (33:53.124)
So yeah, I would say I have all these tools and skills and toolboxes that I use from things I learned.
Travis (34:19.022)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (34:21.536)
create a space where you can show up and support them in any way that they need. I actually had someone mention this to me and I always keep it with me is it’s like, what if I show up to a family and they want nothing to do with me? And she said, then ask them what they need. And if they tell you to go sit in the corner, then go sit in the corner because that’s what they need in that moment. And so sometimes that’s just like,
Courtney (34:38.917)
then ask them what they think and if they told you to go sit in the chair, then they’re fixed. And so sometimes, just like, you know, and especially with –
Travis (34:45.166)
Hmm
Becca Bramley (34:50.176)
You know, and especially with kids, it’s like, if you ask them what they need, they can’t, sometimes they’re not in the head space to be able to tell you what they need. So then in that moment, it’s like, all right, I’m just gonna sit here with you. And then just sitting in silence, because then you’re showing them that you’re still here and you’re still waiting to be with them. So I think that, you know,
just sharing it, there’s a lot of things that keep me going. It is really hard work and it can be exhausting and also too, taking the time for yourself, checking in and like I said, like having that reflective awareness, checking in with yourself and what you’re needing. So if I did just work with a kiddo and we had a crisis like afterwards being like, okay, like what do I need? Do I need to like go sit at the river for a second? Do I need to go eat a snack? Do I need to go get myself like…
Travis (35:39.118)
Hmm.
Becca Bramley (35:42.816)
you know, a tasty drink, whatever it might be. Go be with my friends, my partner, my dog. Like really being able to check in with myself so that then I can refill my cup and then be able to show up for the kid or family or whoever it is fully present and fully there the next time I see them. And then the last thing I would just say is, you know,
Continue to show up with compassion and empathy and authenticity is so important because kids can also They can tell when you’re lying and you’re not being true And if you’re not you know, if you’re just trying to be there and leave like they can feel that and so Really being true to yourself and who you are and silly with these kids
Travis (36:18.574)
Mm -hmm.
Becca Bramley (36:32.64)
Because I do believe that’s how we can ultimately create safety is through authenticity and congruency with these kids and these families.
Courtney (36:41.477)
Yeah. Thanks for sharing all that. I hope that you stick with this for many more years personally, selfishly, because you really are a wonderful caseworker. And just I’m sure everybody listening can tell that you’re very authentic. You’re very down to earth. And the kids, the youth, the families, we all love you. So.
Becca Bramley (36:48.576)
Thank you.
Becca Bramley (36:57.664)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (37:01.482)
Well, I love what you just said or two in the last segment, because I feel like the crossover to that to just also advice the same advice for foster parents spot on, because all of those things, those qualities for self care, you know, interacting through humor, being authentic, all these things are those very ways also that foster families need to engage the kids. And, and I think I often think of how many of the people drawn to, to caring for kids.
Becca Bramley (37:01.568)
Thanks, Courtney.
Becca Bramley (37:13.056)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (37:31.214)
There can be that sense that you know in my compassion to give that it almost seems selfish to give back to myself like there’s I think that’s a common feeling for a lot of people that we need to kind of push back against and say like Self -care isn’t selfish care and that in order to give back and have the oxygen to breathe you have to put on the oxygen in order to you know help so that that was really I love that both for like you said for other
Becca Bramley (37:52.16)
Mm -hmm.
Travis (37:58.702)
caseworkers, but also for foster families, parent foster parents. So as we close this finally out, Courtney and I just want to say thank you again for, you know, just all that you do for children and families in Colorado. If you are a current foster parents, I think the message is, Hey, let’s consider, you know, the needs also, how are you doing? Like if, you know, maybe you feel after listening to this episode, like, yeah, this, this makes me kind of more interested in becoming a therapeutic foster home. And.
Courtney (38:14.661)
I think the message is, hey, let’s consider the needs. Also, how are you doing? Like, you know, maybe still after watching this episode, like, yeah, this makes me kind of more interested in coming up there to the foster home and maybe exploring that, knowing that if you’re a foster family, all things are great. Man, there is no shame in fact, you’re helping the kids by stepping out for a few years after, or whatever. So.
Travis (38:28.75)
maybe exploring that, knowing that if you’re a foster family that also needs a break, man, there is no shame. In fact, it’s you’re helping the kids by stepping out for a season if you have to or whatever. So, yeah, look at that, explore that. I think also supporting foster families is another way, a huge way that’s just as important as being a foster family. It’s helping them stay in the game, helping them love the kids well. And I would say secondarily, it is also supporting the caseworkers.
Becca Bramley (38:40.064)
Mm -hmm.
Courtney (38:41.509)
Yeah, look at that, explore that. I think also supporting foster families is another way of seeing the world. It’s just as important to foster families as helping them stay in the game, helping them love this as well. And I would say secondarily, it is also supporting the case worker because it’s also helping fight back against the attrition of law for foster families. So it’s going to make things smoother and the relationships are ongoing and not more recruiting and that’s always going to be a huge part. So anyway, I think that’s all for now.
Travis (38:57.422)
because it’s also helping fight back against the attrition of loss of foster families. So, which then makes things smoother and the relationships are ongoing and not more recruiting and that’s always going to be an issue. But so anyway, I think that’s all connected. So those are closing words.
Courtney (39:10.981)
Definitely.
Yeah. Well, thanks, Becca, for joining us today. We sure enjoyed our visit, and thanks again for all that you do.
Becca Bramley (39:21.76)
Yeah, thank you.
Travis (39:23.95)
Yep, thank you. Great having you on.
